gid

July 01, 2005

breastfeeding makes her uncomfortable

I'm not sure if we really need another reason not to watch The View, but for all those women who think breastfeeding is a very important part of mothering, then you might want to watch this clip.

How absurd!

Posted by gid at July 1, 2005 08:08 AM
Comments

It is ironic in our society that women regularly expose much their non-lactating breasts just to get attention while nursing moms have to go to such trouble to cover every inch of skin.

For anyone who can handle it, check out these beautiful breastfeeding pictures: http://www.projectgotbreastmilk.com/gallery/index.html

Posted by: leslie at July 1, 2005 08:50 AM

Your point about there being no problem in our society over showing the non-lactating breast, but if you mother shows too much then it makes people uncomfortable. I had not thought of that.

My though on this was that this whole episode was a side effect of feminisms and the demeaning effect it has had on motherhood. I think proof of this is that nowhere in our modern society is femininity praised unless of course it is in a purely sexual context. Now of days mothering needs to be kept behind close doors or it make people uncomfortable. Very strange….

Posted by: gid at July 1, 2005 10:15 AM

Other than the fact that she lied, I agree with her statement. There is no appropriate time for a woman to expose herself in public. To say otherwise is a clear lack of judgment. If the lady had at least tried to cover herself I probably would not have much of a problem with it. I was at White Water a few years back and a lady in a bikini had her top down breastfeeding completely out there in public setting on a bench by the sidewalk. That was clearly a lack respect.

Posted by: Jason at July 5, 2005 12:05 AM

I would also like to point out that she never said not to breastfeed like your post suggested. It didn't even say anything about breastfeeding in public. She said exposing yourself in public. You can breastfeed in public without exposing yourself. One simple way it lay a blanket around your shoulder.

I don't watch the View because I have a job, but I do think this post is unfairly biased. :P

Wow, usually I agree with you on issues like this, and disagree with Ben and Eric. I know, I am going to get it tomorrow at work, but I am ready for it.

Posted by: Jason at July 5, 2005 12:27 AM

Jason,

I would encourage you to think on this some more. I mean no offense by this, but do you personally know anyone who breastfeeds? I think what makes people uncomfortable about seeing breastfeeding in public is their discomfort seeing breasts used as nourishment because, sadly, it is not seen enough in our society, at home or elsewhere.

It's not as simple as you think to be completely covered while breastfeeding a baby. Babies do not particularly like to have their faces covered with a blanket, and often like either to gaze up at their mommy while eating or to check out their surroundings while having their snack. Moms should not feel like they have to stay at home or find a dark or dirty spot (eg, public restroom) if they have such a baby.

When I cover myself completely to nurse in public, I still get uneasy looks. Many people are uncomfortable with the idea of breasts being used by babies, period. I think my breasts are for my husband, yes, but also for my babies.

Posted by: leslie at July 5, 2005 12:04 PM

Has everyone lost their mind? Is it just that society has become so ignorant that they have forgotten how God MEANT for babies to be nourished? People have really lost their way when they start all this nonsense about "well just stick a bottle in their mouth". Or maybe people just don't care if their child grows up healthy or with any sort of bond with their mother.

Posted by: Heather at July 5, 2005 12:29 PM

Leslie ,

I was uncomfortable in my college art class painting a nude model in a room full of people. I would probably also be uncomfortable at a nude beach. There is a reason why movies with nudity (not just sexual nudity) are rated R. If I had a child I would not want him to be walking around an amusement park and seeing some ladies bare chest no matter what activity that lady is doing. I realize there are women who are probably not as covered as they should be, but two wrongs do not make a right. Just because we wish some women would dressed less trashy does not mean we should make a statement by going bare breast in public.
The point is we cover ourselves for reason. There are no exceptions to this rule. I understand having a child has its inconveniences (and no where did I say to find a dark dirty spot, that is just silly), but that is part of having a child. I can not speak for everyone, but I do not think people are as uncomfortable with the act of breastfeeding as they are with the exposed breast. If they are, that is another argument for another time. I have seen woman breastfeed in public who do it in good taste and they did not look awkward or uncomfortable in any way. I have talked with several people who have breastfeed that feel the same way that I do. However, not knowing someone who breastfeeds does not disqualify someone from knowing whether it is a right or wrong any more than not knowing a public nudist eliminates someone from knowing that they should put on cloths before going to the store. The nudist might argue all day (and really believe in their heart that it is natural, and being nude may be natural), but it still ethically wrong.
For someone to really think that we should always be covered up in public in all instances except this one exception because it is a bit more convenient for them is baffling to me. Trying to justify something that is unjustifiable just does not make good sense.

Posted by: Jason at July 5, 2005 01:23 PM

Jason,
In your reply you say "The point is we cover ourselves for reason" but yet you do not give the reason. Is it for health reasons or some other reason that this is the rule with no exceptions? And if this is the rule with no exceptions, why do we not think twice about seeing a man with his shirt off in public?

On to your next statement, "but it still ethically wrong." What do you mean by this? Do you practice Victorian Morality? Should we also be putting skirts on our table legs in the name of modesty?

Breast feeding is a natural part of life. A mother cannot always control when or where her child gets hungry, but according to your ethical system she should deny her child the nourishment it needs to keep you from feeling uncomfortable. How do you justify this?

Posted by: Eric at July 6, 2005 08:24 AM

Eric,

I can’t say I really understood any of your points. They seem silly and clearly miss the point of discussion here.

I am not going to explain to you why people wear cloths, where babies come from, or why guys can take their shirts off in public. I do not plan to let you lore me off into a pointless argument off topic in which you disagree with the very thing you yourself practice on a daily basis.

Eric, please re-read what I have already stated, I have already covered most of you questions about the inconveniences involved. There are a multitude of things a mother can do to feed her baby when they are out of the house. For example, breastfeed but covered, pump breast milk into a bottle before hand if you know you will be in public, or find an out of the way location. Believe it or not, most mothers do manage to get by without exposing themselves in public. I know it is hard to believe, but it is true.

The natural argument, perhaps one of the most ignorant arguments ever made. Where is this rule that says if something is natural you should expose yourself in public? That statement was clearly not very well thought out.

Posted by: Jason at July 6, 2005 10:52 AM

Jason,
After reading your response, I realized that I had committed a logical fallacy. I apologize and have decided to submit a resolution to make it illegal to breastfeed in public to the U.S Congress.

If you would like to check the status of the resolution, it is entitled:

'Resolution 12345: Ban the Boobies!'

Posted by: Eric at July 6, 2005 12:20 PM

I would like to point out that that I not against Breastfeeding in public. However, I think the name of Resolution 12345 is both inovative and creative. :)

Posted by: Jason at July 6, 2005 12:57 PM

"pump breast milk into a bottle before hand if you know you will be in public, or find an out of the way location" ~Jason

Jason, Jason, Jason, where do I start? I think what has been termed your "Victorian Morality" is a dangerous attitude that keeps more moms from breastfeeding. I am a conservative person who is modest while nursing in public, but I am concerned about the social and health implications of people who set the tone that you do. To think that I would have to have a bottle of expressed milk with me before I could run an errand or take a spontaneous ride with my husband and babies to a destination which may be public is ridiculous and rude!

Even more disconcerting is the idea that the nipple on a bottle is more wholesome for public viewing than the mother-baby interaction of breastfeeding. It is an abhorrent and unbiblical suggestion.

"You will nurse and be satisfied
at her comforting breasts;
you will drink deeply
and delight in her overflowing abundance."
~Isaiah 66:11

Notice BREASTS not bottle.
Notice DELIGHT not shame.

Posted by: leslie at July 6, 2005 01:36 PM

The bottle was just one of a few suggestions that mothers actually use. I never said you have to use it. I feel link I am being misunderstood.

Not exposing your breast in public is not going to hurt the baby’s development.

Posted by: Jason at July 6, 2005 02:09 PM

* Bathrooms are often smelly and unsanitary. Would you want to eat your dinner in one?
* Sometimes a dressing room or other private place is either unavailable or a good walk away. What then?
* Babies need to be fed when they are hungry. Would you rather turn your head while a baby feeds or have to sit there and listen to the squawling of a hungry child?
* Have you ever tried eating with a blanket over your head--or breathing? How did you like it? Many babies despise it so much that they will cry and/or refuse to nurse when under a blanket, because they cannot breathe as well or simply because they cannot look at mommy while eating, something many babies like to do. Also, have you ever tried doing something with your hands under a blanket? It can be hard to keep the blanket from falling off when feeding a child, and it can be even more difficult to help a baby find the nipple and latch on while under a blanket.
* Yes, moms can pump milk and put it in bottles, and babies can drink it that way. However, that milk needs to be refridgerated and can only last a few hours at room temperature, so if you are going out for the day, there is a good possibility the milk will go bad before it is used. Yes, there is also formula, and babies can drink that. However, where it may not harm the babies, it can cause breast milk production to decrease, especially if formula is used frequently. Moreover, many breastfed babies will not accept formula and will not even accept bottles.
* Moms can't always return home when baby is hungry. What if a mother HAS to be somewhere all day, the DMV or doctor's office perhaps? Or to the auto repair shop? Trips to many places that are necessary to make can often take several hours. Should moms who need auto repairs not be allowed to have their cars fixed to avoid having to breastfeed in public?
* Even when a mother uses a blanket, it is still difficult and sometimes impossible to get the child to latch on without showing a bit of skin.
* However, just because a dressing room is available or a mother-baby couple do well feeding with a blanket in place or with bottles, that doesn't mean that they have to. Nothing in the Constitution declares that you have the right not to be offended, to make others do things or not do things to avoid offending you, or that you have to do things or not doings to avoid offending others.
* Breasts were designed for producing milk and dispensing it to babies, as with all mammals. It is natural. For those of you who say "Urinating is natural; should we be allowed to do that in public?" that reasoning is completely illogical. Breathing is natural; should we be allowed to do that in public? Lots of things are natural. Some things should be done in private, like having sex or urinating. Eating, however, is not one of those things. If I decide I'm against eating in public and convince others that it is wrong, too, should everyone be banned from eating in public and all restaurants be closed just to avoid offending my group and me? Also, urinating and defacating in public is a health risk... but breastfeeding is not.
* Many experts encourage breastfeeding on demand, extended breastfeeding, and self-weaning which can take up to four and a half years--and is completely normal, natural, and healthy.
* Lots of sickos get their jollies off watching children play soccer, just as many get their jollies off watching women
breastfed. Should children then not be allowed to play sports?

My son often will refuse a bottle and refuse to nurse while under a blanket, and often times there is no suitable private placeavailable. I try to pull my shirt down or angel myself away, but if being discreet is interfering with my babies meal, I stop worrying about it. I'm all for being courteous to others and trying not to offend or do things that might make someone uncomfortable, but sometimes it's just not possible. Moreover, it is every woman's choice whether or not to care about what others think or how others feel, and if a woman doesn't want to be discreet, nothing on our lawbooks or in our Constitution prohibits that. Instead of expecting others to consider you, be responsible for your own self, and LOOK AWAY.

Posted by: Heather at August 25, 2005 05:52 PM

Heather you make some good points. I like your thoughts on [Lots of things being natural], and that eating is one of them. Also, if you knew Jason you would know how funny your " Bathrooms are often smelly and unsanitary. Would you want to eat your dinner in one?" comment was.

Thanks for the comment.

Posted by: gid at August 26, 2005 01:32 PM

I have never seen The View, but then I don't get TV reception at all (we have two tvs but they are for video, dvd, and video games). Based on that clip, it would appear Ms. Walters is totally in the wrong.

I breastfeed my baby all the time, in public or not. No, I don't have to expose my entire breast to do so, but yes sometimes a little bit does get "flashed" (my baby does NOT like to be covered with a blanket, and will just pull it off). If someone is staring intently enough at my chest to see that, that is their problem and not mine.

Posted by: Charlotte at December 20, 2005 03:48 PM

I can't understand why so many people have gotten this holier than thou attitude about a woman breastfeeding her baby, regardless of where she is. This is the original way created for the sole purpose of feeding an infant. Excuse me for being blunt and crude, but it is a bunch of B--l S--t that a woman can bounce her nude tits around to entertain a bunch of people, but then it's indecent to feed a child this way. You nice-nasty people get more stupid every day. When I was growing up, nothing was thought about a woman feeding her child this way. This is not kinky--this is natural. I was at a optional, family resort a few weeks back and saw a young woman breast feeding her child. Believe me, there is nothing more beautiful than to see a baby nursing at its mother's breast. I make a point to congradulate the woman for not falling into the stupid attitude of our modern day society. My wife and I mentioned to her that this was a very important stage for the child in forming a strong bond with the mother. Also, it gives the child the natural immunities from the mother to help ward off disease. One man tried to tell a lady, that was breastfeeding her child in a restaurant, that this was disgusting--that she should take the baby to the restroom to finish breastfeeding it. What I can't understand is--if it was so disgusting to see the lady breastfeed the child, why didn't he take his steak and baked potato to the men's restroom to eat it. This would have been more appropriate, since he wanted someone to eat in the restroom. People loosen up. Give these young mothers a break. I haven't seen a young mother yet, to start to breastfeed an infant in a public place, without putting a blanket over her shoulder, placing the baby under the blanket, and then undercover of the blanket-proceed to let the baby nurse. These young mothers are very careful not to expose themselves to anyone. This might have been why the guy got indignant about the mother letting her child nurse. He didn't get to set and ogle her while the infant nursed. So, the next time a lady goes to let her child nurse, if it offends you, why don't you take your food to the restroom to eat and not create a disturbance?

Posted by: Horace M. Everett at August 19, 2007 02:14 AM
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